Thursday, August 16, 2007

The Case of Misty Horner

I don't know why this case doesn't get more attention. But I aim to change that.
Everything about this case pisses me off and makes me want to puke.

I think I'll have to add a new hobby to my profile. "Photography, playing my congas, doing everything I can to make sure that John and Caleb Horner get sent to a 'pound me in the ass' prison to rot until they die of ass cancer and septic shock."

The following background was from reporting done by KMBC.

"Misty Horner died on Jan. 9, apparently of septic shock. The month before, she had delivered a stillborn child in her Lee’s Summit home.

“Misty had contractions from Saturday all the way through to Friday,” Moore said. “A whole week.”

At the end of that week, on Friday, Dec. 1, the baby came out breach and was hanging out backward, caught at the neck, Moore said.

“(Caleb) didn’t know what the heck he’s doing — he has no medical training, he’s not a doctor, he doesn’t know what he’s doing. He takes the scissors and cuts her and performs an episiotomy. The baby finally comes out, and the baby’s dead,” Moore said.

After that, she said her friend became ill suffering from septic shock.

“The medical examiner told Caleb, ‘Caleb I understand your beliefs. All it will take is an antibiotic and Misty will be OK,’ and Caleb said no,” Moore said.

A month later, Misty Horner died
."




This all happened seven fucking months ago. Seven months in which the Lee's Summit Police Department has been dragging it's feet, covering it's ass and doing everything it possibly could to protect one of its own who is clearly guilty of practicing medicine without a license, spousal abuse and, in my humble opinion, manslaughter and possibly even pre-meditated murder. With his brother John as an accomplice and co-conspiritor.

Only now, have prosecutors gotten involved. From The Kansas City Star:

"Prosecutors have taken up the investigation into the death of a policeman’s wife who refused medical treatment as she battled infection following the still-born delivery of her baby.

A spokesman for Jackson County Prosecutor Jim Kanatzar said today that the office was reviewing the deaths of Misty Horner and her baby, Sydney, but declined to comment further.

That acknowledgement comes after police spent more than seven months investigating the deaths. The case generated widespread interest because the Horner family shunned medical attention as part of their religious beliefs, and because of Caleb Horner’s position as a Lee’s Summit police officer.

Misty Horner, 30, died Jan. 9 in their home. A month earlier, she delivered her stillborn daughter, Sydney Kay. Over that month, several family members and friends visited with Misty Horner, and have told The Star that they noticed her weakening health. Some say they pleaded with Horner and her husband to go to the hospital. But the couple continually refused, citing their religious beliefs, they said.

Police were called to the home Dec. 31 on reports that Misty Horner was “very sick” and possibly dying. She refused aid from paramedics.

A Missouri death certificate lists her cause of death as blood poisoning and infection that spread to her heart and uterus following the stillborn delivery
.

The Mansfields (Misty's parents -XO) have said they felt that their daughter was brainwashed and that someone should be held accountable.

“You can say that your religious belief is to throw a baby into a volcano as human sacrifice,” Darrell Mansfield said. “But that doesn’t make it legal
.”"


The Horners are a bunch of backwater, trailer-trash, hillbilly fucktards whose cultish religious beliefs are killing people. They, and anyone else in the Lee's Summit Police Department or City Government who in any way helped to cover Horner asses, need to be dragged in front of the courts and held accountable for the blood on their hands.

I have LOTS of questions that I'm hoping some of my readers can help answer. This is one time when I actually ENCOURAGE anonymous commentors. All I ask is that you cite sources if possible and help us get some justice done.

Q1: Who the fuck is John Horner?
Q2: Where did John Horner get his religious instruction?
Q3: Is this "Horner Cult" a subset of some recognizable religious denomination? Seventh Day Adventists? Christian Scientists? Jehovah's Witnesses? Mormons? Does anybody know?
Q4: If the "Horner Cult" IS affiliated with a more mainstream denomination, what is that denominations position on the "Horner Cult"? Do they endorse it, embrace it, condemn it? What?
Q5: Where, exactly, is this "church" in eastern Jackson County? I might be interested in attending a service. Maybe they can save my soul from eternal damnation. Shouldn't saving sinners be a larger calling than secrecy? I'm a sinner. Send me an invitation, John. I would LOVE to hear you preach!
Q6: Does this "Horner Cult" have some other name? What do they call themselves?
Q7: How many members does this "church" have?
Q8: Does this "church" enjoy tax exempt status? Isn't that public information?
Q9: Only the teachings about avoiding ACTUAL, PROVEN, SCIENTIFIC MEDICAL CARE in favor of some wacked out cop with a pair of scissors and a prayer have come to light in the news. What other interesting teachings might we find interesting? Enlighten us, John Horner. Come forth and share your divine wisdom!
Q10: How can people be so fucking stupid?

If my younger brother came to me and told me he had received some sort of instruction from God and that me and my family should do whatever he says...I would bitch-slap that ignorant fucker, steal his wallet and kick him into rush hour traffic.

I just have NO PATIENCE and ZERO TOLERANCE for ignorant, superstitious, mystical, supernatural, mind-controlling, domineering, abusive, controlling BULLSHIT! Whether it somes from The Pope or John Horner. It is all the same.

Let's put these sonsabitches behind bars, where they belong.

If you are as outraged by this case as I am, and if you have any information to share, post a comment or send me an email.

I really, REALLY want to see justice done.

29 comments:

Janet said...

Well, they aren't JW's, but as an ex-jw, I actually knew of this when it happened. I'll go back and see if I can find any info. I'm pretty sure the name of their faith was mentioned.

travelingal said...

How can a person like this be a police officer? Aren't they required to give medical assistance to injured people or perform CPR if necessary, etc. in the course of their duties?

Horrible story.

Joe said...

Y'know, Travelingal makes a good point. How can this guy do his job with his religous beliefs? Or, is medical attention good enough for the general public but not his wife? Fucktards, the whole lot of them.

Heather said...

I thought I read something to the effect that this religion was something just within their little circle, not at all mainstream, and founded by that Horner guy. I don't know the basis of their doctrine, but apparently having the IQ of a head of lettuce is a requirement.

I've taken care of patients who belong to religions that ban various aspects of medical care. As much as it frustrates us that they won't allow us to do the simplest of things that would save their lives, we have to respect their wishes, even if they belong to some quack religion.

In that regard, if it is on record that Misty Horner herself refused to be treated, I don't see how they can "throw the book" at Caleb Horner. They might be able to get him for practicing without a medical license (doing the crude episiotomy), but if she refused medical care, I'm not sure they can take this case very far.

I've been watching this case with interest. It's horrible to be certain, and the Horner boys need to be drug through downtown from the back of a truck, but Misty was a grownup with nothing documented that would indicate she was not able to make her own medical decisions. I can understand her parents anger and grief, but they are going to have a hard time proving she was not in sound mind.

Having said this, I hope the Horners burn in hell.

Xavier Onassis said...

heather - "In that regard, if it is on record that Misty Horner herself refused to be treated, I don't see how they can "throw the book" at Caleb Horner."

That is the whole problem. In all of the reports I have read, Misty Horner was treated like a manequin on the couch.

Caleb Horner's Lee's Summit Police collegues came by with an ambulance in tow, trying to convince CALEB to seek help for his wife. HE refused.

I haven't seen any evidence of concerned parties going directly to Misty asking her "Fuck Caleb! What do YOU want? Do you want the one, single, simple shot of antibiotics that will save your life? Or would you rather submit to your hillbilly husband and die a slow, painful, unnecessary death?"

All I have seen are reports of this fucktard Caleb making decisions for his wife based on the teachings of his brother John. I don't know that Misty was ever consulted regarding her health care.

After all, she's "just a woman".

travelingal said...

If I was Misty's mother, I would have grabbed my daughter at gunpoint if necessary and found a doctor or got ahold of the strongest antibiotics on the market and treated her myself. I honestly believe I would have shot the bastard if he tried to prevent me from doing it.

Heather said...

In the event someone is incapable of making their own medical decisions, the spouse has the right to do it. What her parents could have done is gone to court for for DPOA status (I don't know if this was done or not). In an urgent situation, it can be done fairly quickly. If Misty Horner had refused medical care at any point when she was coherent, it would probably be enough for her husband to say he was upholding her wishes. I hate to say it, but had the parents tried to go the court route to get emergency DPOA, they probably would have been denied.

I'm not saying I agree with what happened (in fact, I think it's bullshit), I am saying that is how our medical system is set up. I've seen it happen more times than I care to...a patient's wishes going unheeded because they didn't have a living will, didn't have an assigned DPOA, and next-of-kin pretty much gets to do whatever they want. I saw a patient suffer for 6 monts straight, rotting from the inside-out from cancer, because his kids were selfish, and the patient didn't have advanced directives.

This case resides plainly in that gray area. It's no wonder everyone is reticent to touch it. It comes down to patient rights. If that asshole husband can prove Misty was in agreeance with all this, the courts will more than likely side with him. Just look at what happened with Terry Schiavo.

While the parents may argue that Misty Horner was brainwashed into this quack religion, I don't think it would hold water as there is nothing to say she was incapable of making any decisions. She chose to follow this retard and his brother, and all the consequences that followed. The parents are going to have one hard, nasty fight ahead of them. I wish them all the luck.

Please understand, I'm not here supporting Horner or the rest of the brainless fucktards that follow them. I'm just speaking from someone who works in the medical field, and has seen this scenario play out before.

travelingal said...

Heather...I agree with you. That's why I would have taken matters into my own hands. Probably would be sitting in jail, but at least my daughter would have been alive.

Anonymous said...

XO, your righteous and appropriate indignation is largely mitigated by your 'pound me in the ass' prison slur.

satyavati said...

Wow, I don't have to say a thing because Heather said it all a lot better than I could. So thank you for 1. the validation and 2. saving me an assload of typing..

and XO...I'm sorr for being ignorant, superstitious, mystical, and supernatural but I swear I'm not mind-controlling, domineering, abusive or controlling. Really.

:)

Xavier Onassis said...

heather - "In the event someone is incapable of making their own medical decisions, the spouse has the right to do it."

I haven't seen anything to indicate that she was "incapable" of making her own medical decisions. Other than the fact that apparently the Horner Belief precludes a mere woman from deciding such important matters. Only a Male Spiritual Leader may decide such things.

I respect and appreciate your perspective regarding what the laws, rules and regulations in the medical field allow. I am not suggesting that any medical personnel were in any way negligent.

What I AM suggesting is that someone who cared about Misty should have taken a Louisville Slugger to the side of Caleb Horners mostly empty skull, taken Misty to a hospital for treatment, and filed an ex parte and divorce papers against that abusive bastard before he woke up.

Had that happened, she would still be alive and his sorry fucking hillbilly ass would be in prison where he belongs.

Travel - exactly what I just said.

anonymous - "XO, your righteous and appropriate indignation is largely mitigated by your 'pound me in the ass' prison slur." You need to go rent Office Space.

satyavati - LOL! Don't take any of that personally. Although I personally feel that our planet and it's inhabitants would be better off without any supernatural crutches, I generally don't begrudge people's personal beliefs.

It is only when they start embracing the hubris of believing that everyone else must conform to their views or be destroyed that I have a problem.

I don't give a flying fuck at a rolling donut if people want to believe in God, Jehovah, Allah, Jesus, Yahweh, Krishna, Xenu, Klingons, Tolkienesque Elves and Hobbits, Garden Gnomes or Benevolent Aliens. Just keep that shit to yourself and we will get along fine.

But when you start trying to shove that shit down other people's throats, brainwashing the people you supposedly love, and causing people to die, I'm going to call BULLSHIT.

Janet said...

Heather, I'm sure you're quite familiar with JW's and the whole blood issue.

Are you aware that they are allowed certain fractions? Their Hospital liaison committee (two or three of their elders) are quite aware of this, and can help you convince them to at least get SOME blood.

Yes, it's completely hypocritical, but they will never completely reverse their blood stance because of the thousands of lawsuits they would probably get hit with if they did.

Heather said...

When I worked in Ortho, we used this special ortho-infuser for post-op patients. Whatever drained from the op-site went into a special little machine that spun the blood and reinfused it back into the patient. Apparently, this was acceptable to the JW's because "the blood never really left the body". Just took a field trip?

Had a patient who was a JW and absolutely REFUSED blood, even though it would save her life. Instead, she had her family bring in these nasty smoothies with veggies and crap high in iron. And she had prayer meetings in her room every five minutes.

She still died.

Anonymous said...

JOHN HORNER... the name and similar circumstance rings some bells... an incident in Springfield Mo occured years ago that involed the SAME name...possibly the same man?!?!?! look into it guys.....

Been There 2 said...

You are correct. This is indeed that same John Horner from the incident in Springfield several years ago. John's religious affiliation was with mainstream Pentecostal churches until he fell under the teachings of John Lake, who taught against ALL forms of medicinal healing. The church basically kicked in out (he was actually on staff in southern MO at one time in this particular organized church) for his teachings and ever increasingly outrageous behavior. John then moved back the KC area where he started his own home based church. John's main teachings centered entirely upon how evil medicine was and how the "church" was an abomination. John does not believe in paying taxes or having insurance. He prints up insurance cards of his own to present to officers if pulled over. They look pretty real. John is a control freak who basically makes you feel like you are going to hell if you do not follow and believe his teachings. He thinks that he is the only "preacher" in this country that is right and righteous.
As for where his "church" is at, it is in his home just east of Lone Jack. I wish that I had the exact address because I would absolutely print it here for you all.
You may ask how I know all of this. Unfortunately, I had to learn the hard way...from John himself. And no, I am not some brain dead idiot. I do not blindly follow ANYONE ever. John is a manipulator and is very practiced at the art of brainwashing. It's a fact. I truly believe that John should be held responsible for Misty's death, just as much as Caleb. John does not have anyone's interests at heart exept for his own.

Cloud_Writer said...

I've been watching since day-one too.

'She didn't have to die'
Parents cope with death of daughter denied help by husband
Blue Springs Examiner, MO
By Andre Riley
January 20, 2007
...According to Misty's family, the couple declined medical treatment because of they believed scientific healing was an affront to the healing power of Jesus Christ. THOSE SAME BELIEFS LED CALEB TO ISOLATE HIS WIFE FROM HER FAMILY, EXCEPT FOR FEW BRIEF VISITS, they said...
http://www.examiner.net/stories/012007/new_012007018.shtml

THAT's "ABUSE".


Cloud

OFFICER-INVOLVED DOMESTIC VIOLENCE:
TACOMA SAID IT WAS A PRIVATE MATTER
http://www.MYSPACE.com/tacoma_taser

Anonymous said...

Misty isn't the first person to die at the hands of this cult. Remember the 5 year old little girl who died after the mother allowed John to perform an exorcism. Why wasn't this little girls mother charged with murder! The child threw up blood for 2 weeks and they never called 911 until she stopped breathing!!!!

Anonymous said...

Keep in mind that Caleb and Misty were "married" by John Horner. Which means, they weren't legally married. Apparently John no longer believed in "legal" marriage after his first divorce where his ex took him for half. Caleb had no legal right to make medical decisions for Misty.

Xavier Onassis said...

http://faithslap.blogspot.com/

herrjaymes said...

I know John Horner from attending college with him at Southwest Baptist University in Bolivar, Missouri. We were in the same class from the years 1987 though 1990. We co-led a ministry for about three years together sharing the Christian gospel at college and in areas around Springfield, MO. I spent a lot of time around John one on one and in group settings. I think I know who he is very well, and I am sharing these things because I think we can all learn a lot from my experience with John and I encourage you to post what I about to share on your blog.

People say that John Horner is a hillbilly, dumb, ignorant, stupid, backwoods, money hungry, or as the mother whose child was Victory Rose said "a phony", All of these characterizations are wrong. Please let me explain.

John grew up in Lee's Summit, Missouri in a fairly middle-class suburban home. I met his father once in college and he seemed very nice. I heard about Wendy Horner second-hand. She was characterized as being an outspoken Christian who was not afraid to make here voice known, at the time, more so than John (it was made in a negative tone}. I remember John saying his family was from a mainline Methodist tradition. Why he attended a Baptist college, I am not sure, because he never identified himself as "Baptist." (He may have had a track and field scholarship.) Early in our Freshman year he began to attend Rolling Hills Baptist Church in the southern part of Springfield, MO. Rolling Hills was not your typical Southern Baptist church. It was like an Assembly of God church in worship and doctrine but with a Baptist name. I remember the church had a lot of conflict with the Greene County Southern Baptist Association. They practiced "speaking in tongues" and "all of the gifts of the Spirit", healing services, and stand-up, long lasting praise music. I attended about five or six times. It was not my kind of church. Eventually the association booted the church out and the church changed its name to Rolling Hills Christ's Church. I never knew John to attend or associate with an Assembly of God or Pentecostal Church.

John attended Rolling Hills Christ's Church throughout college. John earned a degree in Biblical Studies and in his Senior year or just after he graduated he was hired on full time as an associate minister there. I cannot remember the name of the pastor at that church, but he was a congenial personality and the church grew under his leadership. The church moved to a larger facility and property on Cox Road in Springfield. Eventually that pastor left to preach somewhere else (for reasons I do not know) and at that point the church became adrift. John was a minister there at this time.

After I graduated I went home out of state. I came back to Springfield to attend a friend's wedding. One afternoon I decided to give John Horner a visit. He lived in a small, modest house with his wife at the time. John shared with me how they met and then married. His story shed's light on his personality. John met her while he was a minister at Rolling Hills and she was in the youth group while in high school. He said that they never dated or spoke in a relational sense until she graduated from high school. He also told me that they had never been physical with each other: no sex, no kissing, not even holding hands, until their "I do's" on their wedding day. This testimony, in a nutshell, describes John's personality: very serious, very dedicated, very extreme. While in college I would knock on John's dorm room door and when he answered he said that he had been praying for hours. He said that he had no time to go out because he had to study Hebrew and Greek and that he was obsessed with being the best in religious study, not for anyone else, but for God. John was a mystic. He claimed to hear God speak to him. He wanted to hear God guide him. And when he thought he heard God, you really could not argue with him. He was convinced. When he prayed, he was so intense to hear God and to make himself available, to know His will. He wanted to know God's heart and wanted to live accordingly. John was tall, athletic, attractive, and had a charismatic personality. He was happy and laughed a lot talking about people concerning their faith. He was God obsessed. I think when John "heard God" it made him arrogant. He thought he knew more than you. He would not take certain professor's classes because he thought they were too liberal. He never was self-critical. He did not want to be in classes that might have challenged his view of God or scripture. I remember one faculty member warn other students to "stay away from John Horner, he's unteachable." John never gave an inch to what he believed was scriptural. I believe John wants so very badly to do God's will and to hear God speak to him that he imagines God speaking to him and gives him instruction. And He wants to be holy so much that he will resort to extremes to prove to God that he his totally committed. Not to kiss or hold hands to his fiance is one example of that. Not to lock doors and rely that God will protect you, is another. Not to take medicine, but only trusting God for healing alone is a third example. Not to call a doctor when your newborn has complications is something John experienced personally:

John's wife at Rolling Hills Christ's Church became pregnant with twins. John, even this early after college, did not let his wife deliver in a hospital. She delivered them at home. What I know through second-hand information, is that one of the twins had complications and John did not allow doctors to look at the child. He prayed for a healing, but the healing never came. The affected twin died. When I was at the house I saw one baby in a swing. John's wife did not look happy at all. I knew something was wrong, but at the time I did not know what had happened. From what friends who went to school with me told me was that John's wife after grieving began to resent John and blamed him for the death of their child. She soon after left him. It was the preview of what would happen to Misty and the stillborn.

I do not know the source of John's belief in the rejection of all medicines and doctors. I never heard that taught at Southwest Baptist University at all. I never heard of John Lake until I read it on your blog. John did not articulate that belief in college. But I am not surprised. It is another way for John to display great faith. And as a test he remained faithful, even after the death of his own child. So I can say that John is a practitioner of his own brand of faith. He is not a phony. He is true to his belief. It's easy to explain that he is a phony, but he is not and this makes him all the more dangerous for those around him. John is not about money either. He is not materialistic. He never was. He is about serving God and being "Godly" and to encourage others to do so. John is not a dummy. John got good grades in college and could engage in debate and conversation.

Years later I looked up John and talked to him on the phone for about an hour. He was in Kansas City and started a small moving business to make money. He was genuinely glad to hear from me and brought up a "book" that he wrote called "If God Started a Church." During that conversation I learned that John had evolved into an extreme faith individual, He rejected modern pharmacology because "pharmacos" the Greek root word of pharmacology, was synomous in Greek with witchcraft, spells, and sorcery. Things the Christian should avoid to remain holy. And he did at all costs.
He also shared that most churches are corrupt and have lost the true New Testament message, and were led by men who did not believe what the New Testament "really" says. This booklet describes John's present day theology and what he means by abstaining from life saving medicine. In short, he believes that a church that will have the utmost faith in God alone will be a powerful and life changing church like the church of the Book of Acts, reaching thousands of people with power. And this is a church he started and leads and he is in it to win Kansas City over to Christ.

herrjaymes said...

In short, he believes that a church that will have the utmost faith in God alone will be a powerful and life changing church like the church of the Book of Acts, reaching thousands of people with power. And this is a church he started and leads and he is in it to win Kansas City over to Christ.

The Book of Acts is a historical account written by Luke to describe the early "acts" of the apostles, those former disciples of Jesus. There are several key passages in this book that Pentecostals, Charismatics of various kinds, and "faith-healer" types refer to as scriptural authority as to what they are doing and teaching. Key of these passages is the second chapter which describes the "baptism of the Holy Spirit" during the Jewish festival of Pentecost, a day 50 days after Passover. Luke describes the Holy Spirit descending on the apostles like tongues of a fire, and when those flames touched the heads of the apostles, they started speaking in many "tongues." During Pentecost in Jerusalem, there were many Jews from around the Mediterranean Sea area that heard these "men from Galilee" and wondered how they knew their own language. And what they spoke about was this new message that we call today the gospel. It is from this point onward that the apostles go from meek and afraid men separated from their now crucified master, to bold preachers of the gospel, speaking with authority and seeing great results. The early church started from this now "spirit-filled" group. If one reads the first 10 or so chapters of Acts, one will observe the apostles performing miracles like Jesus did, seeing many converts, and some like Stephen, preaching to the Jews with such courage that eventually cost him his life by stoning. It is this atmosphere of preaching, miracles, speaking in tongues, mass conversions, and heroic faith and martyrdom that charismatics long for. John is one of those people. He wants a church like the one described in these first chapters of Acts. One of great faith and holiness. There was one example of people giving gifts to the apostles for the church. One couple is said to have given all of their property to the apostles for the help in the ministry. Luke writes that they had lied and kept some of the property for themselves. When found out they dropped dead suddenly. When this happened, the followers had great respect and fear for both the Lord and the apostles. Perhaps this instance in scripture that John explains why Misty died, "for her sins" that we don't know of but God does? I can only surmise what John may believe. But this is the atmosphere that mystics and modern day charismatic live in or want to live in. They generally teach that most churches today do not experience miracles because they have "lost their way' are "corrupt" and have a "lack of faith in the Holy Spirit." Some modern day preachers that ascribe to this are those of the disposition of Oral Roberts, Benny Hinn, Paul and Jan Crouch, Jimmy Swaggart, and many of the TV evangelists from one degree to another. But John is a sepratist. He was never in the mainstream. At SBU, John Horner did not participate much in the school Christian activities, but he had his own group, one of which I was a part for three years. At Rolling Hills, a charismatic church, even John's teachings became more and more out of the mainstream, even there. Now he has his own church and his own doctrine of how that church should believe. He is building his own building for his own church without accountability from elders or other ministers. His pamphlet describes his separation from other churches. Indeed, the title, "If God Started a Church" reveals this sepratist mentality: if someone as perfect as God decided to start a church in Independence, Missouri it would not be like the churches there now. No, they would be like my church that I am envisioning, one that I am teaching about in this pamphlet (emphasis mine). God only knows that churches today are not perfect, but John wants that kind of a church so that it will be like the early church seen in those first few chapters of Acts. And I think he wants to be like an apostle: holy, faithful, true to the end even if it be death, a part of God working in the lives of men, verified with miracles and wonders. Having faith will elicit the power of God. Why this extends to medicine? I do not know. But his teaching makes demands of God that, to me, are not of scripture. Misty did not die because of her sins, but because of an invasion of billions of harmful bacteria and other micro-organisms that entered and infected her body. Just doses of antibiotics and cleansing would have saved her from dying so young. I am positive that if a fire started in John's house he would get a bucket of water to put it out and not kneel down and pray for God to put it out Himself. Why did Caleb not allow antibiotics? He wanted to be faithful. He wanted to believe. He was following John's teachings.

You know, this kind of reminds me of the snake-dancers. There are Christians who dance in church with snakes to "prove" that they are faithful because of verse I believe in the gospel of Mark. It is all fine when the snakes don't bite. They affirm themselves. But when one of those rattlers bites one of the "faithful" reality sets in. They get very sick and sometimes die. John's medical celibacy is like that. Someone has a fever and they don't go to the doctor but are prayed upon, and later return to health, they "are healed." When a child like Victory is sick and the mother wants to be faithful to God for a healing by not taking her to the hospital, and her child dies, reality sets in. John is literally giving snakes out to his "following". Except he takes it to a further extreme. Real faith is not the holding of a snake, it's not getting medical attention when the snake finally bites you.

I can only imagine what John is feeling now. He may be disillusioned with his doctrine. The pressure of his younger brother, whom he discipled, losing his child and his wife may be too much for John to bear. Perhaps that is why he is not giving an interview to the media. John has never been afraid to speak in front of anybody who would hear him. John liked to have the spotlight when it concerned his faith and something he was involved in. Now, I just don't know. I would like to believe that John is rethinking this whole notion of not taking medicine or having doctors. But rethinking something he believes in is not what John does either. He may go further to the edge, convinced that he needs to be even more faithful, of more holy and doing or teaching something even more outrageous. I cannot predict it.

thatwriterchick said...

Re- herrijames' post:

My family and I attended Rolling Hills Babptist (later, Christ) Church in Springfield in the years that John was associate minister there. The pastor, Mike Morris, and his wife Linda, moved to Texas after Mike resigned. I never found out why they suddenly left with no strategy in place to choose a new pastor. At that time, there were approximately 1200 people attending on Sunday mornings, counting both services. I'm not sure how many more were actually on the membership rolls.

Shortly after the Morrises left, the church split when a minister candidate, Gary Hay, was not voted in as pastor. These folks created Hope Community Church, which is still active in Springfield.

The church really got funky with the advent of what most have labeled a "shepherding" group. A group from Oklahoma took over, teaching all sorts of subservience and what they called "apostolic" authority. Basically, the minister (have to locate his name) taught that he was an apostle and had that kind of power. I remember, for instance, a young woman who told our sunday school class that she was "creeped out" by a church member who wouldn't leave her alone. He later told her God told him they should get married, and with the pressure from both the man AND the church leardership, she finally married him (and was miserable).

We left shortly after the really unusual stuff started. I'm not sure when John and Amy left, however. At one point, her mother told me that she and John were living in Texas, following a cultish teaching. The mother said that they were afraid for Amy's spiritual and physical welfare because John wouldn't let her come home to visit and because they were practicing the no-doctors thing. Her mom described Amy as "brainwashed."

I do not know WHO the minister or group was that they were getting their teaching from, but the Texas experience seems either to have initiated or at last solidified John's beliefs about medicine.

When they finally returned to Springfield, the babies were born. This would have been mid-90s; 93-95ish. I remember there was a DFS investigation into the baby's death. Shortly after, Amy divorced John.

Phony? I agree that John seemed sincere back then. However, my dad always had a saying, "What good is it to be sincere if you are sincerely wrong?" John never appeared deliberatly manipulative, only extreme, and certainly charismatic. I agree with herrijames that this is "what makes him all the more dangerous."

thatwriterchick said...

1

thatwriterchick said...

1

Anonymous said...

Well Victory Rose's mom called him a phoney. That is like the pot calling the kettle black.
She is the biggest phoney of all of them. All she does is play victim! Why wasn't that woman prosecuted for allowing her daughter to DIE!
What because she was " strong in her convictions" ( her words)

Anonymous said...

John Horner was my college and career pastor in the early 90's. At that time the church I attended had about 1400 members and over 100 college students. He was a charismatic teacher of the Bible at a mainstream church. He stuck to the basics and to be honest, I really respected him as a believer and leader. But when the pastor of the church announced he was moving out of state, Johns anchor broke. He spoke to us one evening about his new conviction that if we really believe in God, we shouldn't need doctors. We all dismissed him out of hand.
A few years later, he married and his wife had twins at home. One was born dead but after some attempt at recessitation the baby came back. But John refused to take the baby to the hospital and it died within minutes. A few years later the child who lived developed spinal bifida. After months of watching her baby suffer with no treatment, his wife left him and sought help at a hospital.
In the beginning John was a decent college pastor with a lot of zeal. But the zeal grabbed onto the wrong vein and he never let go. Personally I believe strongly that God heals and many sometimes through doctors. In Luke chapter 10, Jesus gave the parable of the Good Samaritan. The Samaritan helped a beaten man by bandaging his wounds and pouring oil and wine on the wounds which was tantamount to medical treatment in that day and age. John needs to get back to what matters: love God with all your heart, mind and soul and like this love your neighbor as yourself.

Doug said...

I also attended Southwest Baptist University, graduating in 1991. I met John Horner there and spoke with him briefly a few times.

I find it interesting that a man who was so intent on finding God's will, or so he seemed to me, could have gone so far off the trail. He was admired by many people at SBU, including myself.

I think that the very thing John was preaching against(self love), had become a problem within his own heart. He would never admit it, but he really seemed arrogant and overly confidnet to me. Being very shy, I always wished I could borrow some of his overflowing confidence. I could've used more and he could've used less.

I am very sad about these people who died because they adhered to this teaching. It is a good reminder to Christians to be careful about where we get our beliefs. This belief about medicine is found nowhere in the Bible. This was John's downfall...relying on another form of "revelation" that fell outside of God's revealed Word.

A said...

This is so strange. I had a dream about JDH last night that has persisted in my thoughts like an aftertaste of spoiled food. I decided to google him tonight, somewhat in hopes of learning any new information regarding legal action in the deaths of Sydney and Misty.

I found this blog instead. It's been interesting reading.

I just wanted to clear up a few errors and note my agreement to other statements.

John & his (only legal) wife were married in May 1993, just 5 days after her graduation from highschool. John had begun a relationship with her a year prior to their wedding, but she had no idea it was anything other than one of "discipleship" until she turned 18. He asked her to marry him one month after her birthday, telling her God had told him she was to be his wife. Despite his portrayal of chastity, he and his fiancee had experienced a deep level of intimacy while still managing to not to have biblical "relations". Technically, no, they never kissed, but other than that, they got as close as they could to the line.

Upon returning from their honeymoon, Pastor Mike Morris announced his departure. John only told his new wife that there were some financial issues as well as personnel issues that were the impetus behind Morris' leaving.

When John's wife's pregnancy was coming to term, but still early, she began labor to deliver twins, at home. But shortly into the labor, she became frightened due to the unexpected pain and excessive blood loss that she knew was not normal. Although she was surrounded by family, friends, her husband and a "lay" midwife (read: illegal, unlicensed), her pleas to be taken to a hospital went unheard. The first baby born was weak, but breathing well and of a good color. The second baby was snow white and John's wife thought she was dead. John's wife, herself, was seriously hemorrhaging from the birth, but as such was too weak to ask for help any longer after being refused before the births. Hours later, John's wife noticed the 2nd baby was acting strange and someone in the house called 911. To this day, the identity of the caller is unknown.

The paramedics were able to restart the baby's heart, but it failed again shortly after arriving in the emergency department of St. John's. This is a significant factor in John's belief system. He has spoken many times about the fact that the baby had come back to life with his prayers as he followed the ambulance, but that upon arrival in the physical hospital, demons entered her body and stole her life in punishment for his lack of faith. He had read that since people of all levels of spirituality die in hospitals, their demonic spirits inhabit the locus waiting for innocent, weak bodies to overcome--babies being the most preferred. This was the clincher on his belief that babies should be born at home, although it started with this philosophy, in his own words:
"God says that children are gifts. And when I get a gift, I don't have to pay for it myself! Gifts are free! It's WRONG for me to have to PAY for my own gift."

That's absolutely correct. His avarice over the expense of a deductible of $200 coupled with additional copays for service was the driving force behind his beliefs that have fostered all of the mayhem that has followed.

When John's wife quickly became pregnant again, John moved her to the KC area to keep watchful eyes off this pregnancy and in hopes of finding work. He had been given 5 weeks paid vacation by the then crumbling administration of Rolling Hills Christ Church to reconsider his position. The end of his sabbatical marked the end of his employment at RHCC due to his even stronger commitment to his beliefs in the power of and will to heal of God.

In April 1995, John and his wife and surviving daughter, now one year old, went to a church in Euless, Texas that sold literature very supportive of John's new belief structure. Many of the couples attending had children born at home, never having had immunizations, and homeschooled. John ardently accepted the philosophy of not immunizing children due to his belief that our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit, and as such, to deliberately introduce into the temple pathogens, even dead ones, was blasphemy. The children who constituted the statistical anomalies of cases where adverse reactions had occurred resultant to immunization, unfortunately, were bearing the consequences of the sins of their parents.

Unfortunately, I can only remember the pastor's name of the church at the time John was there--all the other details have been lost to memory. His first name was Stephen or Steve. I know anyone searching for the roots of John's tangent will be disappointed at that, but I do know at the time, the church had a bookstore, and possibly even a publishing house that published literature in brief, easily-distributed form (similar to tracts).

It was here at this church, which had been a type of college in its history and therefore had dormitory rooms, that the birth of John's son occurred. It was this child who was born with Spina Bifida (this is a correction to a previous post). The birth was extremely difficult for John's wife, and after hearing her cries of pain in labor, neighboring families inquired to the church to see if assistance was needed. Although his wife had been begging John and the other attendant to take her to a hospital, and although John admitted later that he knew she was 100% serious and in her "right mind" in her requests, he flatly refused to allow her to leave the room, instead barring the only entrance/exit with a heavy bed. In her condition, she was unable to move the bed and leave the room and delivered her baby boy imprisoned against her will.

John refused to allow the baby to receive medical care when his wife realized the baby had been born with a common birth defect--so common, in fact, that both John and his younger sister had been born with a milder form of the defect. Approximately 40 days after the birth of the baby, when he began to have seizures, periods when he would not breathe, and fever, his wife took advantage of a time when John had fallen asleep to sneak out of the dorm room, call family and was able to leave with both children, getting them both medical attention the next day. The baby boy was immediately placed on life support and aggressively treated for systemic infection and the girl was treated for pertussus,"whooping cough" which she had contracted from her exposure to an infected, unimmunized child at the Euless church. It should be noted that John completely renounced his beliefs the night that his wife left with his children, vowing he would allow them to receive any and all medical care she desired if only she would not leave him.

Now, let me go back a bit and give some additional history. When John was 9 years old, he had hernia surgery. He was the second in a family of six children, and at age 9, his mother had too many children to care for to be with John during his hospitalization. John's father, also named John, was/is a rididly chauvanistic working man who diligently put in his time at his job, expected his dinner to be waiting on him upon his arrival home, and promptly fell asleep each night religiously. So you see the situation: John's mother was simply too busy to be with her son after his surgery, and John's father did not see his role as one to include nurse.

A study into basic psychology will reveal that fear and abandonment feelings coupled with physical pain at this crucial phase in child development nearly always lead to difficulties in human interactions later on in life. I believe John associated his parents' abandonment of him when he was sick with the then-rigid and rather aseptic mileu of a hospital in the 1970's. John's fundamental belief that God loves him could not coexist with his perception of illness and pain, and therefore he decided that his God simply did not allow such things.

Later, as he grew and began learning more and more of the Bible in both Hebrew and Greek, he would branch out his studies into the fundamentals of medicine and its history. Taking what he gleaned from independent study of medicine, John formulated a religion where the Hebrew God had delivered the children of Israel from the Egyptians. Since all modern medicine has its roots in ancient Egyptian understanding of the human body (most notably "allopathic" medicine--or the medicine with which we all associate typical doctors & nurses in scrubs and lab coats), John surmised that in delivering the children of Israel, God's plan for His children was for them to be free from disease. John firmly holds to the belief that Jesus' death on the cross was one not only to save the sinner from a spiritual separation from God, but the physical separation from God that man experienced as a result of Adam's original sin. This original sin, he belives, has translated throughout man's lineage in spiritual separation from God yes, but ALSO in man's susceptibility to disease and death. Therefore, John has come to whole-heartedly believe that a person who has received salvation by faith in Jesus for his/her spirit & soul, justly receives salvation of his/her physical body while alive here on earth in the form of freedom from disease or in the expression of divine healing.

As you can see, the process by which John has come to hold this belief system is in no way simple or uninformed. He has literally invested years of research into building his version of reality. As John's college associates have noted, he is a very intellectual, charismatic man. At the time of his legal marriage, he was very attractive--his belief of his body being the temple of the Holy Spirit being taken to the extremes of daily rigid exercises and body-building to present the world with an accurate portrayal of what a true believer should look like. Time, finances, location and age have since forced John to "reevaluate" the necessities of a perfect diet and exercise regimen. As he delves deeper and deeper into his perception of being a Christian, he relies less and less on material, external things to evidence his faith, and more and more on his absence of disease and hearing the voice of God as proof of his dominion over the things of this world.

The term "dominion" carries much weight with John"s belief structure. I have mentioned his equating salvation by faith with a lack of disease in the body. He also has taken the scripture that notes that Christ has given us dominion over all things and studied it in the original Greek. The root of the word translated "dominion" relates to ancient Greek polytheism. John has taken this root word and its translation to term himself a "god". He is careful to note the "little g" in the spelling of the word, but firmly believes that he is a god, having dominion over all things on the earth--as is every TRUE believer in Christ. That is, of course, why he could publish a work outlining God's perfect church, because he believes he has the insight of God dwelling in him and as a god, he can accurately relate how the perfect church would be.

As with many psychological breaks, John has chosen to link his "bad" experiences in life with a cosmic evil, associating perfect love, salvation and grace with a God who is against the medical "system". For whatever reason, his nine-year-old mind decided he had done something bad to be left alone in the hospital--later, it was his lack of faith in the healing power of God that facilitated his daughter's death; after that it was his wife's lack of faith that prevented his son's healing--all of these compiling his psychosis that the medical system is satanic and bears the wrath of God.

His second "wife" was forced to bear seven children at home--five of which were preterm and ended in the babies' deaths. His second wife related that with each painful, bloody episode culminating with her delivery of a still born infant, John would adamantly profess that she had never in fact been "with child", but had experienced a faulty "pregnancy" that ended in early termination of an unviable fetus. Their relationship ended a couple of years ago--a long paternity and custody case, since there was technically no marriage to dissolve. John was able to convince a psychological professional of his staunch adherence to his faith while maintaining a firm grip on sanity. An ignorant, back-woods hillbilly would never have been so successful at masquerading his narcissism and schizoaffective traits.

As to Caleb's competency in being a police officer, I'll add that while he attended college in the same town where John and his first wife lived and he maintained a close relationship with John during those years, Caleb was reticent to embrace John's fervor during his first wife's pregnancies and even later during John's son's extended hospitalizations during his first year of life. I believe Caleb accepted the mission of a police officer with honorable intentions and did have the desire and heart to protect and serve. It would appear that the disintegration of John's marriage and subsequent loss of his children (John was granted only supervised visitation with the children) spurred the acceptance of John's faith system by Caleb. Caleb was overtly antagonistic to John's ex-wife in the years following the divorce, and when Misty joined the family (long before they were married) she seemed to share this animosity toward the ex as well. Perhaps the very real reminder of a failed faith was embodied in the ex for them, and as their interactions with her were unpleasant (she was mentioned by a previous poster as not looking happy at all--unfortunately, this was true and continued especially in the areas of interaction between herself and the Horners), Caleb and Misty could easily embrace the antithesis of the disappointment John's ex embodied.

Additionally, there was John's second "wife" and their subsequent relationship break coupled with all those babies born "unsuccessfully"--I can see John living vicariously through Caleb and Misty's relationship. In Caleb, John saw redemption and the potential to successfully demonstrate the validity of his faith through their marriage, pregnancy and birth. Above all, John has stated that he desires the world "to see the Power of God demonstrated through [him]"--ultimately in the healing of the sick and the raising of the dead. I believe nothing will deter him in this endeavor, and his willingness for his youngest brother to sacrifice his child and then his wife is proof of his commitment (or delusion). I also think it is worth considering that John, having felt he's "lost" both his wives and all his children in his devotion to his cause, may have encouraged Caleb that sacrifice would be necessary to attain John's goals. John may have desired someone with whom he could identify, and misery loves company.

Lastly, I want to note that this post has been intended for informational purposes only, and in no way expresses an acceptance or adherence to John Horner's faith. I was genuinely grieved upon learning of Misty and Sydney's deaths, especially in light of their occurance so shortly after the death of Caleb and John's mother.

Judy Horner, the matriarch of the family, developed an ear ache en route to a celebration several states away from Missouri a few months before Misty and Sydney's deaths. She began experiencing worsening pain and total body symptoms, but refused to allow her family to get her medical attention. She decided to leave the festivities early to return home with her husband, but by the time the couple arrived in Lee's Summit, Judy was semi-comatose. Until she completely lost consciousness, she maintained the resolve that if Jesus wanted her to be healed, He would do it--if not, she would be with Him in heaven. Approximately one week after she developed symptoms, Judy died--the official cause of death undetermined since no suspicion of foul play existed and therefore no autopsy was performed.

Having witnessed the devastation John Horner and his followers wreak on humanity--and innocents at that! Children!--I share your desire for vengenance. At the same time, I know that nothing I could wish upon John or Caleb or that little girl's parents compares to what they will experience one day at the Judgment Seat of God. I also firmly believe that for all his showmanship, John is not without his own personal hell. Can you imagine the grief he and Caleb must feel yet are unable to reveal to anyone most of all themselves? Those types of internalized feelings lead only to destruction; it is simply a matter of time before the law of sowing and reaping will take effect. Or Kharma, if you prefer.

ALL of that being said--did anyone notice the "anonymous" comment that specifically said " 'pounding MY ass in' prison"???. Methinks we have a lurker in this string...

Anonymous said...

I grew up two streets away from the Horner family. I was in the same grade as Wendi Horner. All through school, they were very involved in the Youth For Christ (YFC, Channel 50) church. In high school, I was a member of the Lee's Summit High school newspaper. I remember taking a picture of an example of vandalism by someone in their group in the girls bathroom. It was a full-color painted mural of jesus on the cross with a bible scripture on the inside of a stall door. The YFC kids were also known to shout bible cheers at each other in the hallways.

Being an enthusiastic defender of civil rights and separation of church and state at the tender age of 17, I proceeded to write a few editorials chastising such destructive behavior in the name of god, and sighting the fact that it was a public school with many kids of various religious affiliations. Subsequently, I was the subject of a teen panel discussion (mentioned by name several times) on Channel 50 that included the Horner kids. This would have been around 1984 or 85.

Later that year, Wendi showed up on my doorstep crying one evening telling me that, "God had told her to come to my house and save me." As I could see nobody was with her, I said, "No thank you, and quietly shut the door."